What caused the Yeerks to lose

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What caused the yeerks to lose

Visser 3's arrogance
5
36%
Ellemist beating Crayak
2
14%
The human Spirit
7
50%
 
Total votes: 14

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What caused the Yeerks to lose

Post by s0mbo » Tue Nov 18, 2008 12:02 pm

Was it the arrogance of Visser 3, while that contributed, there were obviously other things involved.
Was it the Ellemist picking better people than Crayak, or was it the human spirit?

Please continue discussion of this topic in this thread. - capnnerefir

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Re: What caused the Yeerks to lose

Post by Cyberhamon » Tue Nov 18, 2008 2:33 pm

s0mbo wrote:Was it the arrogance of Visser 3, while that contributed, there were obviously other things involved.
Was it the Ellemist picking better people than Crayak, or was it the human spirit?
Actually it was a combination of all three. The human spirit is very strong. Santa picked people that would allow him to capitalize on this advantage. And the arrogance of the Yeerks in general was also beneficial to the victory.
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Re: What caused the Yeerks to lose

Post by tinsolitus » Wed Nov 19, 2008 8:53 am

I agree that to an extent it was all three, but I also think that the main aspect was Visser 3's arrogance. It made him blind to the obvious. If he wasn't such an idiot, there's no way 6 kids could have beat an entire advanced alien empire.

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Re: What caused the Yeerks to lose

Post by Snoopy » Sun Nov 23, 2008 7:46 pm

I know it would sound noble and heroic and all to say that it was the human spirit that caused the Yeerks to lose, but that simply isn't true. If Visser 3's subordinates hadn't been so terrified of losing their lives, they would have discovered that the Animorphs were humans way back in Book #4. As it was, it took them all the way until, what was it, 50? before they finally clued in.

Now, that's not to say that the human spirit couldn't have caused the Yeerks to lose. After all, if the Animorphs had gotten killed, or had never existed, who knows how things might have gone. I can easily imagine billions of people committing mass-suicide once the truth got out about the Yeerk invasion, thus defeating the point of the Yeerk's invasion of earth. But the fact is that that is all speculation. The human spirit had nothing to do with the Yeerk's losing.

Oh, and by the way s0mbo, it's spelled "Ellimist", not "Ellemist".
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Re: What caused the Yeerks to lose

Post by Cyberhamon » Sun Nov 23, 2008 9:09 pm

Hence my assertion that all three played a contributing role in the Yeerks' downfall.
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Re: What caused the Yeerks to lose

Post by capnnerefir » Sun Nov 23, 2008 9:19 pm

All three of those answers are wrong. The reason the Yeerks lost was a Deus ex Machina on KAA's part because she wanted to end the series. If it wasn't for author intervention, the Animorphs wouldn't have made it past the first few books. There are so many times when they got by though sheer blind luck; and in a book, luck is nothing but deus. If it wasn't for KAA's help, the Animorphs wouldn't have won the war; they wouldn't have even lasted more than a few missions.

Visser Three's arrogance, while it may have led to minor losses, was not enough that he could lose a war when he had such a massive advantage. Hell; with that kind of advantage, Xiahou Mao would have beaten Zhuge Liang. There is simply no way to lose an open war (which is what it became) with those advantages. His troops were stronger, faster, better trained, better equipped, could infiltrate anywhere, and were basically unopposed. No one can lose a war with those advantages; it simply isn't realistic. Deus.

Ellimist picking a better team? I didn't see Crayak picking a team. Sure, he probably had something to do with Esplin's life, but that's it. Never mind, Crayak had nothing to do with Esplin; Visser Three admits in book 48 that he's only ever heard of Crayak; they never had any interaction. Crayak wasn't trying, so this point is a nonissue.

The human spirit? That's a joke, right? It's the height of arrogance to assume that humans are any more spirited than any other race. The Yeerks had just as much heart and spirit as anyone else.

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Re: What caused the Yeerks to lose

Post by EmberGryphon » Sun Nov 23, 2008 9:31 pm

capnnerefir wrote:The Yeerks had just as much heart and spirit as anyone else.
I agree with this statement.

The Animorphs won because of a really convenient situation, a whole bunch of black powder, and near-to-actually suicidal recklessness.
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Re: What caused the Yeerks to lose

Post by Snoopy » Mon Nov 24, 2008 9:10 am

capnnerefir wrote:The human spirit? That's a joke, right? It's the height of arrogance to assume that humans are any more spirited than any other race. The Yeerks had just as much heart and spirit as anyone else.
Well, I kinda disagree. See, humans in general would rather die than be someone else's slave. And they will fight hopeless battles. These are foreign concepts to the Yeerks. We've seen that throughout the series. But the fact is, it never came to that.

And, when I voted for V3's arrogance, I meant of the options listed, that was the biggest factor. Of course, the biggest factor is just plain luck.
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Re: What caused the Yeerks to lose

Post by EmberGryphon » Mon Nov 24, 2008 9:03 pm

Snoopy wrote:
capnnerefir wrote:The human spirit? That's a joke, right? It's the height of arrogance to assume that humans are any more spirited than any other race. The Yeerks had just as much heart and spirit as anyone else.
Well, I kinda disagree. See, humans in general would rather die than be someone else's slave. And they will fight hopeless battles. These are foreign concepts to the Yeerks. We've seen that throughout the series. But the fact is, it never came to that.
That's true, but keeping in mind that human priorities are different than those of the Yeerks... Yeerks seem to be more mindful of the effort of the collective than of the individual. They don't fight hopeless battles because they operate in groups; they assume another Yeerk will complete the job if they fail. That doesn't mean they have less spirit, at least not in my opinion. And yeah, while Esplin and Tom's Yeerk might have been much more concerned with their own personal safety than the liberation of their brothers and sisters, one has to keep in mind that many, many, many more nameless Yeerks died knowingly in efforts to aid the collective of their species than did humans. Maybe humans would have died in bulk rather than be taken into slavery had they known, but one has to acknowlege that plenty of Yeerks died for their cause, too.
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Re: What caused the Yeerks to lose

Post by Snoopy » Mon Nov 24, 2008 9:33 pm

EmberGryphon wrote:
Snoopy wrote:
capnnerefir wrote:The human spirit? That's a joke, right? It's the height of arrogance to assume that humans are any more spirited than any other race. The Yeerks had just as much heart and spirit as anyone else.
Well, I kinda disagree. See, humans in general would rather die than be someone else's slave. And they will fight hopeless battles. These are foreign concepts to the Yeerks. We've seen that throughout the series. But the fact is, it never came to that.
That's true, but keeping in mind that human priorities are different than those of the Yeerks... Yeerks seem to be more mindful of the effort of the collective than of the individual. They don't fight hopeless battles because they operate in groups; they assume another Yeerk will complete the job if they fail. That doesn't mean they have less spirit, at least not in my opinion. And yeah, while Esplin and Tom's Yeerk might have been much more concerned with their own personal safety than the liberation of their brothers and sisters, one has to keep in mind that many, many, many more nameless Yeerks died knowingly in efforts to aid the collective of their species than did humans. Maybe humans would have died in bulk rather than be taken into slavery had they known, but one has to acknowlege that plenty of Yeerks died for their cause, too.
Oh, I agree that Yeerks had plenty of spirit. The point is not that the Yeerks were spiritless, but that they had a different kind of spirit. They don't fight hopeless battles. Humans do. That's the difference that might have one day caused the Yeerks to lose. But of course, it never came to that.
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